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Elovia

Mount and Blade: Warband

146 posts in this topic

Renwalds are awesome. I nearly did the same, but at last minute before diving into combat, I quickly pulled up the troop trees in reference material and looked them up.  I went for it, too, but I started with nearly 100 units and barely survived. Btw, it is possible to find them in the merc guild and hire them (rare but possible). Same with other Falcon troops which you can train upward to them.

Spent some time last night poking around the game files with morgs (sp?) editor. Was thinking I would preconfigure the hired mercs to my liking. Didn't get much chance because ... Valentines Day (again? *sigh*).

Yeah, this is turning out to be an awesome mod.

Edited by Elovia

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I edited them as well.  What I did was just even out the skills, but kept them on level.  For instance the level ones got a 5 point increase in base stats, then balanced the skills.  Took out the zeroes for throwing, bows and such.  The other thing I like to do is edit the companions, I give them new names, and boost their base stats significantly.

I learned that xbow troops are expensive!  Like 10x the regular troops.  I gave my warriors some spears, one handed weapons, and a shield then put them in shield wall formation.  It seems to give them a proper balance.  I thought about this after my renwalds run-in.  I could have easily just swapped all my infantry to spears and probable done rather well.  Swap the ranged to bladed x-bows for added effect.

Edited by Jag

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I like that some companions are well developed, whereas others are relatively blank canvases.

Yeah, hired merc costs go up dramatically with increased damage potential ... not just on the individual weapon selection, but also with combinations of melee and ranged weapons.

Supposedly a lot of hand balance went into weapon design, so they're all relatively equal - the difference being how they're applied which falls on the players use of strategy and tactics. Sometimes you'll find yourself on an unfavorable map and get head-punched right out of the box. That becomes an educational opportunity to reconfigure your warband and/or units to handle more diverse situations. :) 

Just going to point out that you have choices in how to manage troops in combat. You can give them a variety of weapons with different damage types, and then tell them to use a specific damage type only. At the unit level, you can also assign infantry, for example, to two different groups: one where you order them to use pikes/polearms and another that is ordered to use sword & shield. This last may not be as optimal since one unit type may be inherently weaker than another higher up in the troop tree.

I'll play around a bit more with the troop editor to see how difficult it may be to add a new branch (or two) to the hired merc troop tree, which may help provide even more flexibility in gearing them out. Maybe make a skirmisher line off the infantry one, and maybe a cavalry-archer line off the cavalry line.

Edited by Elovia

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In the camp options you can split a stack of the same troops to do exactly that, I have not checked to see if I can equip them differently.   I use this option to allow pincer moves, and or to put archers on different parts of a castle.

 

If that works then editing may not be necessary.  Since you can split them into different stacks and assign them to different groups.  Not sure if you can add troop types (something about max troops at least in other mods), but you can steal an unused troop and link the upgrade path to it.

I thought I could only switch to blunts, did not realize there were options for spears and such.

Edited by Jag

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There are options to force certain weapon choice behaviors (e.g., force spears, bows, and mounting). Not sure how well those would work as defaults then modified by in combat commands.

You may be right; I've only ever commanded the use of blunts (F3-F3 by memory) but I thought you could specify others, too. Some things I remember well and others not so much ... It comes with age. :) 

I also haven't played any with stack splitting, so didn't/don't know how well that works.

We'll figure this out one way or another.  Too bad others around here don't also play so the discussion would have more than just us as participants.  I know they want to only because they've been ignoring this active thread so much; the harder they ignore it, the more they want it. :) 

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I think Jazz would have a blast with this, there are plenty of rp options to keep him interested.  I think Wolph would enjoy it since he liked chivalry.

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Think I may have tried it or an earlier version but couldn't work out how to fight in it and just never got round to going back to it.  Will take a look and see if I have it, it does sound like something I'd like.

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I think I found a combo that works well for me.  Footmen - swords, shield, wardart, long spear.  Shieldwall formation, then stand closer two to three times.

Archers - bow, arrow, arrow, 2 handed sword

Calvary - Sword, shield.  Then still messing with a 2 handed blunt/1 hand blunt then either a lance, or something thrown.

Cost at all tiers seems to only be around 30-40 per troop.  Maybe the crossbows are bugged, or maybe they are just that strong.  It is a bit of an exploit, but I suppose I could just change the entire army out into bladed crossbows just before a tough fight.  The dwarven ones can fire 3 times before reloading, but ai accuracy seems poor.

To supplement my fighting force I am keeping a pack of 50 or so random whoevers that I just use as fodder to disrupt things so the elites can destroy.  I may have to increase that number so the battle advantage mechanic does not eat me up too badly.

 

Edited by Jag
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The battle number mechanic is always important to remember. When I was playing A New Dawn regularly, it wasn't uncommon to need 250-300 low level units just so you didn't get limited to 23 units vs 150. I used to pad my expensive elite units with masses of entry-level units; the elites did all the work.

The same is true for garrisons. The game engine doesn't look at the quality of troops when deciding who to attack ... just quantity. You can keep garisons stocked with cheap fodder and usually be safe.

I thought I read that in this latest version of Perisno, they tweaked the AI/outcomes to take troop quality more into account during autocalc battles.

In my current rebuild, I'm slowly getting my troops back up to par. To help the process, I'm using more random bounty hunters in the mix to take pressure off my developing knights.

My knights are heavy cavalry with one-hand blunt and heavy shield, two-hand sword (cut and pierce), and knight's lance.  My archers currently double as infantry: heavy plate armor, one-hand sword (cut and pierce) and tower shield, bow and arrows.  I also have options set where unhorsed cavalry and out-of-ammunition archers are automatically put in the infantry group; this seems to work for the interim until I can get my heavy infantry troops built up in levels and numbers.

I currently have industries in all but one town (that leige doesn't like me for some reason).  And I've just begun purchasing available land for rental income; the Falcon town, all Hakkon towns, and all Elf towns thus far.

I've hired almost all companions except Slyter and Uldin (sp?). These two have higher looting skill than I do, and I can't have that so I briefly hired them, stripped them of all their belongings, and sent them away. I now see them occasionally in the taverns ... naked and poor. /evil laugh

 

Edited by Elovia

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I am not going to join a faction, I am going to play, build my power first then make an attempt at one of the small kingdoms.

Did you try splitting a stack?  I forgot. Seems just as good to diversify the equipment.

Edited by Jag

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I did and didn't. I looked closely at the interface and it allows you to designate a portion of one group to a different group. So you could, for example, split off some infantry and designate them as archery so they would follow commands directed to the archery group. Consider that there are up to nine(?) commandable group designations available, you have choices.  I think this is more for splitting a group of a single unit type to better allow for flanking and pinching maneuvers.

I also looked at weapon type command and you were correct that the choice is either blunts or free choice. One problem I've noticed with the use blunts only command is that units without blunt weapons stand still and do nothing.  This occurs even if that unit type theoretically has blunt weapons assigned in their inventory. I guess some sell their issued weapons for beer money. /shrug

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I like to play as a neutral and build up an economy while raising honor and right-to-rule. Then when I'm ready to make my move into the next phase of kingdom management, I'll try to take a town under foreign occupation ... meaning a town traditionally owned by one faction but occupied by another.  This is especially effective if both factions are embroiled on multiple fronts. Just be prepared to sue for peace with the traditional owners. Then start collecting enemy lords in your prison (decline ransoms) to reduce backlash assaults.

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I decided to try something I have never done before, a rebellion.  So I have taken my small army, only 80 but elite, to the land of Falcon.  I joined up and am working on currying favor with the local lords.  We shall see how it goes.

Have you rescued any villages from the Nobles?  Wow it was hard.  The cost was great in lives, but the loot was epic!  A 40k value sword and a Darkwood bow, skill 10 is going to take a while, but I have the weapon.

Aside from mercenaries, the best way to get Falcon troops seems to be that you rescue them?  Do you have a better way?

 

 

Edited by Jag

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You mean the quest given my the faction mercenary vendors in the taverns? No, I have not yet. Good to know the loot is good, while the encounter is tough.

If you join the Falcons as a vassal, you can recruit “nobles” at the town (maybe castles too). These are not the same as the Falcon troop tree, but they're not worthless by any measure ... they're just not the same.  The devs have outright said they deliberately do not want to allow recruiting Falcon troops from villages for now.

That said, rescuing them is viable. I've also hired light renwards at the merc guild.  If you pay close attention, the rebel peasants in the Falcon territory are the low level units on the Falcon troop tree. Last night I spotted a group of bounty hunters cleaning up groups of revolting peasants; I even helped them a couple times to improve relations before the inevidable backstab assault to rescue the prisoners we just caught together. I still ended up with net positive relations with the bounty hunter faction.

There are new rules on rescue, too. Apparently you should not be able to rescue-recruit units above your level. So renwards are probably off the table; light renwards may be too. But Aepael Fealcons (sp?), the “recruit” level, are much easier and available ... then just grow your own from there.

Edited by Elovia

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Played a bit today and found a reasonably quick way to get Falcon troops, but you first must have a viable warband to begin.  Get hired as a mercenary to the Falcon faction.  The nice thing about that is that you get paid an upfront fee, plus they pay for your troops (for example, my warband wages are ~33.7k, and I get reimbursed for 12.7k per week), so your investment profits are larger.  When the realm goes to war, your warband should be on par with or better than the local lords.  Clean up enemy forces after they've fought and taken out your local lords, and then rescue-recruit the lord's previous units after you defeat the now-weakened enemy.  I was able to inflate my warband's numbers of Aepele Fealcons, Light Renweards, and Renweards.  I also rescue-recruited some very high level (re: expensive) "noble" units to use in the interim to replace fallen Hired Mercs (until I can get back to the guild and hire/train more).

I got tired of my Hired Riders getting prematurely killed while in training, so I put them in their own group called "Trainees".  One of my first commands is to send the Trainees off to a safe corner, while the rest of the cavalry bear down on the opposing enemy line.  I find that I'm more of a command General than a combat participant.  Welp ... all those stat points in strength and agility and all those skill points in power draw, shield, and riding may seem like a waste, but I guess I can wade into combat at any time if needed. :)  Levels are coming much slower now, and I realize I should have started earlier to pump stat points into Charisma for Leadership skill.  My warband is somewhere between 160-170ish, but it could stand to be much larger so I can compete directly against some of the special groups out there running around (e.g., Nibor Hood, Lord Ceylius, Dreaded Nightmare, etc.)

Started doing a lot of bounty quests from the taverns to pump up Honor (i.e., refuse the blood money).  Also started sending out Companions to boost Right-to-Rule.  When at war with another faction, you can build up honor - and lord relationship coincidentally enough - by letting captured lords go.  I've also been pumping relations with all of the Falcon lords ... without actually being a vassal.

I have now invested industries in every town, and I own land in most of the southern realms (i.e., Elintor, Falcons, Hakkon, Kaikoth, Drahara, Kuu-lan, Tolrania).  About the time I've made a run through all of the cities, the rents refresh and I get to do it all again.  That doesn't stop me from picking up targets of opportunity along the way for quick ransom payments and to wholesale slightly used gear.  As it stands, I'm making a steady profit and I just passed 1.5m or so in pocket.  I could burn a bunch of that on more land in the northern towns, but I'm not sure I'd have the time to collect it all.  I've already collected some great gear ... not all top tier, but close enough ... and will have to luck into finding anything better (e.g., masterpiece and lordly qualities).

Oh ... did a couple of the mercenary captain quests to take out the nobles pillaging a nearby village; I didn't have anywhere near the luck you did on rewards.  I got average fare junk.

Edited by Elovia

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I started the game with 7 in looting.  I tried a few more, and the loot has dropped off considerably.  The first 3 or 4 were epic.  So I got tired of the falcon clan never going to war, said screw it, and took my own castle.  I don't remember the name atm, but it is the one castle kingdom next to the desert.  It is quite easy to defend, multiple choke points, great archer spots.  I have already held off significant forces, although I am starting to weaken a bit.  I think the storm is almost over.

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Interesting. I decided to go ahead and become a vassal for the Falcons because they were at war with both the Elintor and Kaikoth.

I kicked a lot of elven and dwarven butt this weekend (didn't hurt that monday was a holiday).  Got tons of Renweards and Light Renweards. I was even granted the elvish town of Elisnor after a particularly decisive seige. Going in I was nervous that we were out gunned (every elf unit has a bow?), but my fleet of sharpsooters cleared the walls enough for infantry (and dismounted cavalry) to gain the walls and eliminate their advantage. We've since made peace with the Kaikoth (and the Hakkon picked up where we left off) and made even further progress against the elves by taking the town of Lille (sp?).  The new finance system is evident now that the elven lords are having difficulty raising sizable warbands due to impacts to their income. They run around with 30-50 units and are easily overrun.

Sounds like you took over the Kuu-lan town. They're similar enough to the Drahara, and with their close proximity to the lands of both giant clans, I wonder how well they would do in combat using their bow cavalry and the giant's infantry.

Good times.

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Ah ... the Cretas-something-or-other monastery.

Forgot to mention ... I hired quite a few Household Guards (40+). Yeah, tbey're expensive, but they're better than my hired knights and renweards, and I have money to burn. If you haven't already tried thes guys, they're not outfitted the same way as the hired mercs; they're outfitted directly from your inventory. Think about.the implications of that. You can give them Lordly quality armor, Masterwork quality weapons, and they can weild artifacts ... every unit with only one set of starter pieces. They're stronger AND CHEAPER per week than my best hired units ... just pay the upfront fee.

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I can give them the flaming sword, or the one from defeating the dread army?  My Darkwood Bow?  Do they have sufficient skill to wield those high level weapons?

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Yes. As I recall, they have 10 skill in power draw and strike. Also very high proficiencies. Stats in the 30's.

I gave my guards the darkwood bow and all my top tier personal gear. I don't recall what I gave them for melee and shield off the top of my head but it was pretty bad-ass gear. They ride on heavy perisno twilight chargers (or whatever they're called - the black and silver ones).  I confirm they can use artfacts ... I have flamebringer, kingslayer, and the doom sword.

Edited by Elovia

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That sounds great.  Do I get them from my minister?

I have been playing a lot of gal civ 3 with family, so I have not been playing as much.

Edited by Jag

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You get them from the Chamberlain, as I recall ... one of the castle dudes that you hire to help run your fiefs. He (and another fella) came around only after I got awarded the town. I don't have a castle, so cannot vouch for which all dudes you get with one of those. In previous mods, I learned castles were money sinks whereas towns has viable economy and income. Is that still true in Perisno? Or did they fix that in this mod with the financial system overhaul, and castles are viable again?

I passed on the opportunity to purchase a masterwork darkwood ranger bow ... required 12 power draw skill. No one in my party has that or is likely to get it (without cheating - which was very tempting). :( 

 

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