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Jag

Star Wars

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SW: The Force Awakens was released on my Son's birthday so I took him to the first morning showing.  Since then it is starting to become a regular birthday event for him.  This year he wanted to invite some school friends so we are waiting til Saturday.  So don't come here Friday after seeing it and post spoilers.  ;o

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5 minutes ago, Boag said:

So don't come here Friday after seeing it and post spoilers.  ;o

I am not coming here till I see the movie.  Thinking the soonest I can get there is Sunday.  I don't even like it when people theorize on what was going to happen.

Edited by Dunnar
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43 minutes ago, Boag said:

SW: The Force Awakens was released on my Son's birthday so I took him to the first morning showing.  Since then it is starting to become a regular birthday event for him.  This year he wanted to invite some school friends so we are waiting til Saturday.  So don't come here Friday after seeing it and post spoilers.  ;o

My kids B-day is the 12th.  So I am hauling a crowd of his 14 year old friends out to see it. 

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30 minutes ago, Jag said:

What a let down.  6/10.  

I feel ya. I think I definitely need to view it again. Right now this is how I rank the movies:

1. A New Hope

2. The Empire Strikes Back

3. Return of the Jedi

4. Revenge of the Sith

5. The Force Awakens

6. Rogue One

7. The Last Jedi

8. The Phantom Menace

9. Attack of the Clones

 

I was so hyped to see this movie but it was such a let down.

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On 12/16/2017 at 0:44 PM, MTGZuby said:

1. A New Hope

2. The Empire Strikes Back

3. Return of the Jedi

4. Revenge of the Sith

5. The Force Awakens

6. Rogue One

7. The Last Jedi

8. The Phantom Menace

9. Attack of the Clones

 

I was so hyped to see this movie but it was such a let down.

This list pretty much sums it up for me, maybe a bit switching around near the top, but other then that, yeah Last Jedi was down there with Clones and Menace.

So many times in the movie I looked around the theatre like "is this really happening?".

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As much of a SciFi nerd as I am, Star Wars seems to be the most overrated franchise in history. It's more a triumph of marketing and world building, than actual quality of the movies.

The original movies? Awesome. Last Jedi was hokey, but the series wrapped up nicely.

The 'prequels' were all bloody awful. The Force Awakens was a meh remake of the first movie. Rogue One was actually a hit... so Star Wars, as a franchise, is basically batting .500. 

I'll definitely see this Star Wars movie, but I definitely notice people are too easily giving Star Wars movies high grades based purely on the franchise, rather than the movies standing out on their own.

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I've said this before: put an actual dog turd in a box (this is not a metaphore for movie quality), tell everyone it is a dog turd, slap a Star Wars sticker on the box, and thousands of people will still buy it.  Some will even give it high-ratings in reviews, and try to convince you beyond all evidence to the contrary that it is the greatest dog turd imaginable.

Sad, really.

Edited by Elovia
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I thought it was quite good. Best of the last 3. My lad rated it his best film ever, 10/10. I am currently around 76% - but i want to watch it again. It had some stunning set pieces, two dreadnought battles of course. But i just couldn't stand the plot bait that meant, with all that tech, they couldn't remotely control the big rebel ship.

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I thought it was an okay movie.  5/10

Spoiler

I should note, I came into this movie with no preconceived notions.  I do not read any theories, I did not read anything about this movie.  No reviews, nothing.

Lets start with the tone of the movie.  Star Wars movies start out serious.  That sets the tone for the entire movie.  A battle scene, long ship, that sort of thing.  This one starts out with ... laughter.  Didn't realize I was going to see a comedy.  That comedic tone is evident throughout the entire movie.  Almost every serious sequence is capped with a comedic punch line.

The vast majority of the movie is spent on a pack of star destroyers chasing a transport ship and waiting for it to run out of gas.  I don't even know what to say to that.

There are massive plot holes and unexplained events.  They spent all this time on Snoke only to have him unceremoniously killed and left him completely unexplained.  All this time spent was spent on Rey's parents and they turn out to be ... nobody?  Really?  So we are left with a villain that has seemingly greater powers than the Emperor, yet is a complete mystery.  And he tries to convert a hero, who is so powerful she can just picked up a light saber without training and beat his apprentice.  And the origin of her powers are completely unexplained. 

Speaking of unexplained .. how the hell did Luke die?  What the hell?  Your greatest hero, the biggest legend ... just dies?  For no apparent reason?  One second he is "tricking" Ren and allowing the rebels to follow the fox, next second he is gone.  Cause of death ... bad writing.

The throne room scene with Snoke is a straight copy of Jedi.

Captain Phasma was a completely useless and unnecessary character.

The Vegas trip, sorry casino trip was an irrelevant sideshow.  Didn't they learn from the prequels to leave out the dopey kids?

And to top it off, they did a piss poor job of picking villains.  Phasma is not menacing nor a badass.  She could have been, but a blue eyed chick with a British accent is more akin to Marry Poppins than evil storm trooper.  Snoke looked like a souped up ET.  Ren is more childish / spoiled brat than a villain.  And Hux ... oh boy.  All of them completely suck.  Now, compare that lineup to the Emperor, Vader, Boba Fett, Jaba and even throw in General Tarkin ... those are bad-asses.  Those are evil dudes that you wouldn't want to f with.

On its own, it was an entertaining movie ... but not a Star Wars movie.  The writing and story were closer in quality to the prequels than to the other movies.

Edited by Dunnar
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Spoiler

Other than Luke exhausting himself to the point of death, and finally having accepted his failures then completing his "redemption" then surrendering to the force to become a Force Ghost, I have no answers.  Even that answer is poor plot.  Very poor effort.  I can't wait until the next movie, with a new director and vision, to ruin things even more.  I am still disappointed.

 

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Spoiler

And another thing that ruins a ton about the universe.  Weaponized light speed.  Remote control aside.  3 whole movies have been centered around massive death weapons.  No one ever thought to light speed ram a ship before?  Or toss a hyper-drive on a rock?  Just bad writing.

They are chasing these fast transports that can't be caught because they are lighter therefore faster than the entire enemy fleet, that somehow stays together despite being different sizes, no fighters?  Faster than the fighters too?  That already attacked once, but with only 3 of them?  It just goes on and on and on.  Terrible effort.

 

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Watched The Last Jedi yesterday.  Let me just make it clear that, despite certain things I really enjoyed this film and rate it higher than The Force Awakens by a large margin.  In fact, I would put it up there with Empire Strikes Back and Rogue One as the top tier Star Wars films for me.  The plot, despite certain issues, holds together and is actually a plot compared to Abrams' set pieces that he calls a movie.  I would not say it was a deconstruction of Star Wars as I have seen some people saying or a clever take, I have seen an article stating that this film doesn't care for what you think Star Wars is, I would point people who believe that pseudointellectualism to Empire Strikes Back (of which it is pretty much a spiritual successor to, though fortunately its not a remake of it like TFA was a remake of ANH), Revenge of the Sith, and in fact Attack of the Clones if you look closely enough. 

"OMG the heroes don't win and actually make things worse!!!"  Well yeah, that's pretty much Luke's rescue attempt in ESB guys...

Rather than simply list the films as this would require me to decide between films that I like for very different reasons, I am going to do a tier system, with tier 1 having the best Star Wars films and getting successively worse from there.

Tier 1: Empire Strikes Back, Rogue One, and now The Last Jedi.

Tier 2: A New Hope, a film that if you look at it objectively now is actually quite dire but which for its time was game changer and not just because it started the Star Wars franchise but for sci-fi movie making.

Tier 3: Return of the Jedi and The Force Awakens.  RotJ starts off well with Jabba's palace, but quickly becomes derivative with the second Death Star and the whole Vader redemption arc and trying to turn Luke to the darkside feels juvenile and badly written.  TFA is an improvement over the prequels but suffers from being too much a remake of ANH coupled with the Abrams bollocks that make me wonder who the fuck gives him the jobs he gets (should really give TFA kudos here for being watchable in spite of Abrams' influence).

Tier 4: The prequels.  Some say Revenge of the Sith was decent, but it still suffers the same problems the other two have, which includes bad saber fighting (spinning around while not hitting anything isn't dramatic guys) that go on way too long in settings that make no sense and feel like a computer game, bad acting, bad plot, bad everything.  People only like it because it finally has Vader in it, and it ruins the Vader image.

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Mark Hamill regrets criticizing Luke character

Quote

I, at one point, had to say to Rian, ‘I pretty much fundamentally disagree with every choice you’ve made for this character. Now, having said that, I have gotten it off my chest, and my job now is to take what you’ve created and do my best to realize your vision,' " Hamill recalled.

During an interview with the Spanish outlet SensaCine, an emotional Hamill said, “I almost had to think of Luke as another character. Maybe he’s Jake Skywalker — he’s not my Luke Skywalker. But I had to do what Rian wanted me to do because it serves the story well."

In an interview with The Daily News, Hamill called himself "the host body to which this character has been assigned."

"That’s the problem. When I disagree with the direction of the character, I get a little mouthy,” he said. “Like when the trailer came out and the line is, ‘It’s time for the Jedi to end.’ There’s no way, I don’t care what happened to this guy. Jedis do not give up. It’s just inherent in them.”

This is something else I had a problem with.  The nature of developed characters were altered.  Already developed personalities were reprogrammed to fit this story, not the other way around.

Luke was not the Jedi we watched grow up.  Yoda was the guy we saw before Luke found out who he was. 

Spoiler

Leah, who didn't understand or use the Force ever, all of a sudden sucks herself back in the ship after being in space ... really truly awful scene btw

Speaking of the Force, are there any limits to it now?  Seems like its getting more like Harry Potter, where you can learn a spell to do almost anything.

On 12/24/2017 at 3:05 PM, Jazz said:

Tier 1: Empire Strikes Back, Rogue One, and now The Last Jedi.

Funny ... I completely disagree with TLJ, but 1000% agree with Rogue.  I think that was a exceptional movie.

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Keep in mind I'm not a Star Wars fan, I can appreciate episodes 4, 5, 6 (or whatever they are) I don't think they are the best movies ever.  I went into the Last Jedi expecting to like it because I've heard so many people complain about it, and usually when most everyone hates a movie I end up liking it.

Spoiler

 

During some serious scenes, they went to humor too often and killed the moment.  During big intense battles someone had a zinger and it just felt out of place.  

The way they handled Luke was a complete mess.  All the build up of milking the weird space cows for their milk and he dies like that?  I'm guessing they wanted to move on from the character but didn't want to pick who should kill him, so he sacrificed himself instead.  

Leah all of a sudden becomes a super hero?  That scene that she flies into space and becomes superwoman and flies back to safety was hilarious.  

The Rey and Ren throne scene near the end was really cool, but they had a moment to really change the course of the entire franchise when Ren tells Rey "We can rule together, lets change things".  I took that as him reaching out to hear for help and to change the way things have been done.  She had a chance to make change from the inside and possibly avoid more wars.  Wouldn't have it been cool to see a political Star Wars movie that featured Rey winning hearts and minds with Ren?  But instead, they basically rebooted the franchise and we're back to square one.  I thought TFA was trash and a rip off of a New Hope (scenes almost the same frame by frame) but what was the point of that movie?  Nothing they did in that movie meant anything in this movie.

The "rebel scum" line was cringe inducing and just fan service.  Come on Star Wars, you should be above that.

The Casino storyline was completely pointless and could have been cut from the movie.

 

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On 27/12/2017 at 0:35 PM, Wolphard said:

sw.thumb.jpg.914ffd350b06a178a3f3f9094245e8c8.jpg

It wasn't that he went and hid that people had issues with, its that he went there with the sole plan of just dying, to let everything fall apart.  Obi-Wan and Yoda went into hiding in order to train Luke when he was old enough, they had a long term plan at least, and they were expecting Luke to do the same, not just be drinking Blue Milk out of animal tits.

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I was a bit upset by that at first, but the more I think about it maybe it makes sense.  Looks at Lukes development in 4-6.  He tries to grow up, but he doesn't ever really mature.  He never gets the discipline he needs to mature.  Name a mature decision Luke makes?  I think a lot of people get caught up in Luke from the books (that are no longer cannon).  That Luke is absolutely amazing.  Movie Luke is pretty good in combat situations, but a total fuck up everywhere else.  He lost to Vader at cloud city, he lost to Palpatine in Death Star 2.  He doesn't show anything even close to leadership.

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11 minutes ago, Jag said:

I was a bit upset by that at first, but the more I think about it maybe it makes sense.  Looks at Lukes development in 4-6.  He tries to grow up, but he doesn't ever really mature.  He never gets the discipline he needs to mature.  Name a mature decision Luke makes?  I think a lot of people get caught up in Luke from the books (that are no longer cannon).  That Luke is absolutely amazing.  Movie Luke is pretty good in combat situations, but a total fuck up everywhere else.  He lost to Vader at cloud city, he lost to Palpatine in Death Star 2.  He doesn't show anything even close to leadership.

Yeah, I was just pointing out that the reason the meme gives why people were arguing against it isn't actually their argument.  I don't think I know a single person who has said that Luke wouldn't go into hiding, it was the reasons for hiding and what he was up to there that they have the issue with.

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